Stock Market Investors Grow But Investment Shrinks in Brazil

    Brazil's stock exchange Bovespa,

    Brazil's stock exchange Bovespa, From July to August, the number of natural people investing in the São Paulo Stock Exchange (Bovespa) rose by 320 people, from 528,769 to 529,089 investors. Still in August, corporate investors totaled 22,927 accounts, which represented 4.15% of the total base.

    According to figures by the Brazilian Settlement and Custody Company, most of the natural people investors are from São Paulo, with 48.8%, followed by the state of Rio de Janeiro, with 25.36% and Minas Gerais, with 5.82%.

    The study also shows that most are male, 76.34%. However, the number of women with capital invested in the stock market is on the rise. In 2002, women represented 17.63% of the total natural-person investor base, reaching 24.62% at the end of last year. In August 2008, the total rose 22.7%.

    Despite the number of natural-person investors in the stock market, the financial volume has been falling. In the first half of the year, the total invested was 6.2 billion Brazilian reais (US$ 3.7 billion), in July it dropped to 5.6 billion reais (US$ 3.4 billion) and in August, to 4.8 billion reais (US$ 2.9 billion).

    The Bovespa index on Tuesday reached 54,404 points, which represented a reduction of 1.37% over the previous day. This information was supplied by the Commodities & Futures Exchange (BM&F)/Bovespa.

    Anba

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    • Show Comments (36)

    • dnbaiacu

      Financing…..? (Joao)
      We need Ch.c 😀

    • dnbaiacu

      Joao…
      🙂 My poor user name 🙁 😀
      Please give me a break 😀

    • dnbaiacu

      Joao
      [quote

      I think that lots of people in Brazil will bother to read the Magazine in English and comment on the articles in Portuguese. Why not?[/quote]
      Wow! I never thought of it that way.That would be a good idea. Especially considering all the English schools there are in Brazil. That could be the target market

    • dnbaiacu

      OPPS! Augustus
      Augustus .. I did this before I read your request :DLOL.
      I am going to try to hold it in.

    • dnbaiacu

      Augustus…
      [quote]11) Finally, I hope there is a remote possibility to maintain a BARE MINIMUM CIVILITY between us, going forward, in light of my previous statements. [/quote]

      This will take out the fun 🙂
      I will be myself and say.. “Just turn the other cheek” 🙂 (That’s from the “Sermon on the Mount” by the way). It always works.
      On occasional instances you can decide between one of these two tactics.
      [quote]À‚ Do not answer anyone stupid according to his foolishness, that you yourself also may not become equal to him.

      5À‚ Answer someone stupid according to his foolishness, that he may not become someone wise in his own eyes.

      [/quote]
      Proverbs 26:4,5
      We don’t want Ch.c to slow his roll.. It’s just way too informative 🙂

    • dnbaiacu

      Augustus
      [quote]
      7) my Areas of interest and relative expertise are HISTORY, POLITICS, SOCIOLOGY along with a bit of Political Economy and Anthropology… As such, my editorials would inevitably concentrate on either the historical analysis along with political culture touched by socio-economic matters…. [/quote]
      I am going to keep this in mind 😀

      We all have to take each other cyber personalities and input for what they are worth. 🙂 You have to admit some good “stuff” is to be learned off this board. We really all need to get together and create our OWN magazine. 😀 It would be a GREAT mix.
      Problem would remain.. Translation . And just how many people in Brazil would bother to read it , to make it profitable.

    • dnbaiacu

      Ch.c is….
      [quote]Finally who remember that a few months ago I wrote : the best emerging market on nearth is now ….THE USA ?????????
      [/quote]
      The Man! 😉 😉 😉
      Genius!

    • George

      Investor growth…
      This investor growth can probably be attributed to the growth in the economy. Lula needs to make sure that he doesn’t run this growth into the ground.

    • João da Silva

      Augustus
      I donÀ‚´t have a website of my own (Alas). But please try sending an e-mail to my boss at :

      flatbreadmann@gmail.com

      He is a nasty fella,but I get to read the messages first. 😉

    • AUGUSTUS

      JOAO
      i do not have a website. Even if I had one, while I would be willing to provide you the information, I surely would NOT want everyody else to do so! This is my concern. I see no way to realistically communicate with you, directly should the need arise…. 🙁

    • João da Silva

      [quote]How would you communicate with DNB or any other Blogger who might want to participate as a “founder”? [/quote]

      I don’t know how to communicate with Dnb or Ch.c, but i do know how to communicate with Forrest. btw, do you have a website?

      I agree that Dnb is a budding entrepreneur who is involved in an interesting project in BA. He is quite bright and his religious “proclivities” do not bother me. He has his own views and we have ours. As we said earlier, we agree to disagree. 😉

    • AUGUSTUS

      JOAO
      Joao – You may have missed the underlying factor/element within my question…

      How would you communicate with DNB or any other Blogger who might want to participate as a “founder”?

      That was the gist of the question? What are the options for disclosure? Surely you are NOT considering disclosure of the indispensible (basic) initial information here (then again WHERE/HOW?)

      P.S. Despite Dnb obsessive religious proclivities, I agree with Joao’s assessment of the young (colorful) man with questionable, amusing designation (BaianaCU) 😀 😉

    • João da Silva

      Augustus
      [quote]DNB // JOAO – IT ALMOST “SOUNDS/SEEMS” SERIOUS TALK..[/quote]

      It is a very serious talk, indeed.

      [quote]In fact, I have occasionally wondered how Joao successfully managed to get so much information about other bloggers… I dare say His Grace must either have turned “Jeeves” into the most efficient of all spies, OR has access to a crystal ball, OR perhaps even the Oracle, currently located in Geneva…[/quote]

      You have to study the people that are like minded as you are. If we want to better the country, you have to be open minded and listen to people regardless of their nationalities, color, religion, etc;

      Dnb is one of the smartest kids that I have come across and his idea is very sound.

      [quote]OR has access to a crystal ball, OR perhaps even the Oracle, currently located in Geneva..[/quote]

      No, I don’t have e-mail to the “oracle” located in Geneva (He considers himself to be too important to divulge this). However, let me assure you that I do have e-mail of Admiral.Brown who is the original author of this idea. 😀

    • AUGUSTUS

      DNB // JOAO – IT ALMOST “SOUNDS/SEEMS” SERIOUS TALK…
      Naturally, I must presume the previous conversation was nothing but an amusing thought….
      Otherwise, how would you “realistically” assemble, outside these pages in order to make concrete, substancial, and legal arrangements…
      I cannot even see how such plans could even get “started” without initial public disclosure of one’s personal information, such as name and e-mail address… In fact, I have occasionally wondered how Joao successfully managed to get so much information about other bloggers… I dare say His Grace must either have turned “Jeeves” into the most efficient of all spies, OR has access to a crystal ball, OR perhaps even the Oracle, currently located in Geneva…

    • João da Silva

      dnbaiacu
      [quote]Financing…..? (Joao). We need Ch.c [/quote]

      I don’t think that it involves too much money to start one. But we need Ch.c as a consultant as well as columnist on World Trade (other regular bloggers too). We need a Marketing Structure to sell advertisements.

    • João da Silva

      dnbaiacu
      [quote]My poor user name smilies/sad.gif smilies/cheesy.gif
      Please give me a break[/quote]

      One thing Ch.c, Augustus and I have in common is to make “friendly” fun of your “user name”. So give us a break and put up with our jokes. 😉

      btw, you should seriously consider about developing the “MAGAZINE”.

    • João da Silva

      dnbaiacu
      [quote]We really all need to get together and create our OWN magazine. smilies/cheesy.gif It would be a GREAT mix.
      Problem would remain.. Translation . And just how many people in Brazil would bother to read it , to make it profitable. [/quote]

      You are the third person who is suggesting this. Last year, our friend Forrest launched this idea and I fully endorsed it. Now you are proposing it.Great.

      I think that lots of people in Brazil will bother to read the Magazine in English and comment on the articles in Portuguese. Why not?

    • João da Silva

      dnbaiacu
      [quote]Ch.c is….The Man! [/quote]

      It is a pity that he is not a Brazilian. He would have made a wonderful Benevolent Dictator. 😉

    • João da Silva

      Augustus
      Wow, I just got to see the exchange of comments between the Swiss Guru and the Brazilian born nobleman and I was impressed! You have to read the title for his comments:

      [quote]To Augustus the not so Genius and to Joao the not so stupid !!!!! with smiles[/quote]

      Observe that he has not called us both “Junkies” which itself is a big progress. 😀

      [quote]11) Finally, I hope there is a remote possibility to maintain a BARE MINIMUM CIVILITY between us, going forward, in light of my previous statements.
      [/quote]

      Alas, your hopes are not going to come true. Ch.c likes to trade “friendly insults” with his “associates”. He is a kind of guy with whom you can discuss new projects and he would be ready to give suggestions to better them.

      And Milord, you are a very welcome addition to this blog. Being a Brazilian born Aristocrat, you have every right to question the “Navel Caressing” of our proletariat “Rulers”.

      I am sure that our young friend DnBaiana CÀƒº will readily agree with me. 😉 😀 😉

    • moody et al

      Investing in the mountains of Itaipava.
      [url]http://www.flickr.com/photos/95995253@N00/tags/dedodedeus/[/url]

      [url]http://z.about.com/d/architecture/1/0/B/l/glasshouse.jpg[/url]

    • AUGUSTUS

      My turn to reply JUST for the current Almighty ruler of the ORACLE— CH-C the First and Only
      I have replied to you before, but you never seem to have acknowledged them
      I repeat here crucial information which I have previously attempted to convey:
      1) I have never EVER claimed to be a genius – far from it
      2) My knowledge of Economy and World Economic matters is LIMITED and GENERAL – I have never claimed expertise, and have already praised your FAR superior position on this matter (more recognition is impossible)
      3) You do not seem to understand that I have NOT lived in Brazil for several years, and the last time I spent any time there – back in 2000 in Sao Paulo, was representing an American company along their (bank) clients
      4) I was always a MAJOR critic of Brazil – AND I MEAN “MAJOR” for I had always despise their attitude (lazy, superstitious, inefficient) BUT because I was born there I considered my self ENTITTLED to criticize, since I always considered correct for a MEMBER of the household (even living outside) to criticize his own house…. My STRONG objection to you in the past was primarily because You are NOT Brazilian (I’m sure you are saying “damn right” ) and because you were always so condescending and mean towards a poorer country / and naive individuals… I would never have felt comfortable insulting less advantageous, poorer individuals as you obviously do.
      5) Regardless, of the above, I obviously got used to your insulting mannerism and got persuaded that It might not (AFTER ALL) Be a bad thing to have some “nasty foreigner” shaking up some sense into the minds of otherwise PASSIVE, SENSELESS Brazilians, which was often another source of my criticisms…
      6) Because I have already explained that I’m FAR from your knowledge in Economics, statistics and lack the necessary interest which would warrant further study, I could not attempt to equate any of my modest attempts to provide editorials related to economic matters to anything you can easily generated… Hope this is clear now
      7) my Areas of interest and relative expertise are HISTORY, POLITICS, SOCIOLOGY along with a bit of Political Economy and Anthropology… As such, my editorials would inevitably concentrate on either the historical analysis along with political culture touched by socio-economic matters….
      8) I have no intention to continue engaging into pointless screaming and/or finger pointing discourses against you, not only for the reasons outlined above, but because I have already realized that my antiquated artillery contains only “bullets”, and would, therefore, never place me in a position to match your far superior À¢€œnuclear missiles (or that of your supporters)
      9) WHEN I referred to Joao as your “PARTNER” It was not my intention to imply SERIOUS BUSINESS PARTERN in any firm way, YOU MISUNDERSDOOD ME again (in fact, that is one of your bad points, you act on assumptions very quickly and tend to strike based on them). My use of partner was meant as an “associate” and I was paraphrasing JOAO – who from time to time warmly refers to you as his “Swiss associate”
      10) Moreover, I HAD NO IDEA that JOAO got the expression BUT BUT BUT from you…. Had I known it was YOUR patent / trademarked terminology I would NEVER had dreamt to have emulated it…. My previous use of BUT BUT BUT, was solely an attempt to be “amusing” towards JOAO… REAST ASSURE I shall ever use it again around here!
      11) Finally, I hope there is a remote possibility to maintain a BARE MINIMUM CIVILITY between us, going forward, in light of my previous statements.

    • moody et al

      It isnt even a year and it is still strong. But what does Warren Buffet know?
      NEW YORK, Oct 18 (Reuters) – Billionaire investor Warren Buffett said on Thursday he has been buying the Brazilian real currency, noting that it has doubled in the last five years against the dollar.

      Buffett, who is the biggest shareholder of insurance and investment company Berkshire Hathaway Inc (BRKa.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz)(BRKb.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), disclosed the stake in an interview on Fox Business Network.

      “It’s quite unlikely that if you had told me 10 years ago that I would buy the Brazilian real, I would have thought you were crazy,” Buffett said.

      “In the last five years, the Brazilian currency, in terms of the American currency, has doubled in value,” he added.

    • moody et al

      http://www.google.com.br/search?hl=en&q=t boone pickens on brazil
      T. Boone Pickens has a Plan. Granted, Custer had a plan also, but I think T. … Brazilian ethanol is sugar based and has a much higher energy output/energy …

      3. End the corn ethanol subsidy. It does nothing.

      4. End tariffs on Brazilian ethanol. Brazilian ethanol is sugar based and has a much higher energy output/energy input than corn ethanol.[url][/url]

    • moody et al

      Little Heidi is holding on to her Credit Swisse bars of chocolate gold, even as they arrest her bankers for investment fraud.
      there is a time to buy and a time to sell, when gold was $1000 the dollar was at its weakest value. Now gold is $800 and heading south time to buy dollars and buy something cheap like Bovespa, or Petrobras. The new game is the dollar, and it is on the rise. Brazil and all its commodities become cheap vis a vis the dollar. And the EU and Germany in particular are heading to RECESSION and all the loss of wealth that entails. The rise in the dollar is the new game, buy Brazil while it continues to be a stable cheap investment. Everybody has to eat and Brazil is the largest producer of food on the planet, next to Switzerland of course.

    • ch.c.

      And more just for Augustus……..
      your “Disclosing that your Swiss partner has direct “stakes” in the Brazilian territory certainly explain and to a certain degree (almost) justify the Swiss Python etc etc”….still doesnt make you right.

      A) Joao is NOT my partner and he did NOT say he is my partner
      B) My interests on Brazil dates back to well before our farm
      C) As an indepedent fund manager, I manage my money and my clients money in different countries, at times.
      D) My general culture has been made through readings not watching Novelas
      E) I did not go to Brazil for the last 12 years, and our farm dates dack to 2006 at the depth of Your farm prices that collapsed
      by 50 % in only 2 years and by as much as 72 % in Mato Grosso.
      F) My general culture and knowledge doesnt stop in Brazil, but includes the other BRIC members and many emerging markezs and developed nations.
      G) our farm in Brazil is my first venture as an entrepreneur, meaning supervising a company as a board member as opposed to buying stocks in Petrobras, Cia Vale or in whatever type of companies in Brazil or elsewhere.
      H) Contrary to what you may believe, we dont grow Brazilian coffee in Brazil, but imported Haitian beans, planted them, grow them and export 100 % of the harvest. We do it the “Swiss Way” : imagination, investments, efficiency, that makes out the premium quality of goods produced….not only…..in Switzerland. Like NestlÀƒ© produce bottled brazilian water for sale to Brazil, it commands a premium. Like NestlÀƒ© transforming coffee and selling at a premium in many many countries.
      Like NestlÀƒ© producing evaported milk in Brazil with Brazilian milk and exporting these products to many countries at a premium prices to Brazilian competitors.
      Somewhat funny that I, not a Brazilian, knows far more things about Brazil, than an apparently educated Brazilian such as Augustus the Genius the one so good at writing in prose but understanding nothing and knowing nearly nothing else, especially in economy, past and present, but still insisting He Augustus is right.

      Just put 1000 Swisses, Germans, Americans, Japaneses at the helm of your various governmental agencies with a high freedom and in 20 years Brazil will be a wealthy and developed country. If i were your “sugar/ethanol Minister” I will reduce by 20 % your production capacity. Prices would immediately DOUBLE, generating huge profits, rather than losses due to this 10-15 % excess production. Buyers would line up. NO NEED FOR SALES PEOPLE. Just tell buyers there could be more only if they pay the “right” price. I would also convince other sugar producers…India and Thailand…. to do the same.
      If you compare sugar/ethanol with oil or grains, the smallest divergence in world production and demand creates a BOOM or a BUST !
      Just imagine ROLEX making 500 millions watches a year. Prices would not go up but HARD DOWN, regardless of its real value and real production costs.
      Hopefully you realize how The ROLEX name shines all over the world, despite it is “only” a 5000 workers company. Poors are dreaming to have a ROLEX once, not a Chinese watch. In the meantime most can afford a Swatch or a Chinese watch. Even poors know the value of a ROLEX. Even thieves know the value of such a watch. Some are willing to kill to get one. But not ready to kill for a Swatch or a Chinese watch. They are not dumb !

      No need to be a Genius. Imagination is what has made succesful people more wealthy than others.
      And idiots believing that the developed nations have pillaged their country in the past will have their children saying the same in 30 years : “look at how we have been pillaged, oil in 2040 is worth us$ 500.- a barrel when it was only US$ 120.-…… in 2008”
      Laugh….laugh…laugh…laugh !!!!!

    • ch.c.

      To Augustus the not so Genius and to Joao the not so stupid !!!!! with smiles
      Augustus, sorry BUT your paraphrasing of Joao for…. BUT…. BUT…. BUT…are MINE not Joao !
      😀 😉 😀 😉

      Joao :
      – to make a long story short,
      A) we planted Neems in several hectares with which we make part of our pesticides, but the majority is still syntetic pesticides. Still this reduce costs anyway and we -“look” greener in our marketing !
      B) Believe it or not but we bought a special truck just for cattle manure. Around 10 kms from our farm is a feedlot. We made a deal : we will take out part of their manure for a very small insignificant nominal fee but bearing all the take out fees of what we collect. And we spray this manure to our farm but it also replace only part of our fertilizers. This manure spraying last only 2 or 3 months and is not during the course of the whole year. But at manare spraying “season” the truck is busy 14 – 16 hours per day, Saturday and Sunday included.

      Let me give you a few interesting ideas that Brazil should develop but is doing nothing :
      – Never heard about the Pangasius fish ? You should investigate. An astounding fish growing from fishlets to several kilos in less than one year ! A real booming export for Vietnam. If there would be more both the USA and the EU would import more. And the fish is fed in large cages. Easy to grow and handle. Every cage produces around 100 tons…EACH YEAR !
      – I must constantly smile about China appetite for food. Outside of grains for humans and animals, The trend is for more and more processed frozen vegetables, ready to cook and serve. Well 10 % and growing fast of France (probably other countries as well) processed frozen vegetables come from……CHINA !!!!!!

      You have the land, the sun, the water, the very low technology needed and you do…NOTHING for what WE want but persist with arrogance on what we DONT want !
      Stimulate your brains. From Harsh self critics new ideas should emerge. Pro active critics are positive not negative.
      Just think of it : has my country ever be arrogant to sell Rolex or Swatch watches (1 expensive – 1 cheap) ? Or spinning machines to China, India, Brazil, Pakistan despite we have the world largest company ?
      As I already told you, arrogance never pays off when you have an official representative job !
      Do you think one second that Vietnam has an arrogant marketing for their fish, or China is arrogant to sell their frozen vegetables to developed countries ?
      Believe it or not but Switzerland will import around Us$ 50 millions of agricultural machineries from China this year. Well lets the farmers make up their own mind ! They will make their own mind if these products have a good price/quality just as well as consumers can chose Swiss or Chinese watches, cheap or expensive.
      And let wholebuyers accept or refuse our premium quality coffee.

      😀 😉 😀 😉

    • AUGUSTUS

      JOAO SURPRISES WHICH ENLIGHTEN // QUESTIONS DEFERRED
      Disclosing that your Swiss partner has direct “stakes” in the Brazilian territory certainly explain and to a certain degree (almost) justify the Swiss Python strong opposition and previously mysterious “interest” in a country which appeared to be solely the object of hatred and despise… It surely clarified many lingering questions.

      As for the suggested queries to be addressed to the “Oracle” (apparently now located in Geneva) I will leave it to you to formulate such questions (since there would not have been any acknowledgement to any inquiry emanating from my quarters…

    • João da Silva

      Augustus
      [quote]On the other hand, not playing the À¢€œdevilÀ¢€™s advocate, couldnÀ¢€™t the such re-emergence also be considered as yet another contributing factor for a possible extension of the next Brazilian BUST?…[/quote]

      I am afraid so, unless Ch.c says otherwise. The last two posts of his make lots of sense, though he said that I was wrong about the period of extension of the “prosperity”. I suggest we re read his comments and come back to question him. But he is DEAD RIGHT about the fertility of the soil in the “Old World” including the Eastern countries.

      btw, he owns a farm in Western Bahia where he and his partners are experimenting on growing Blue Brazilian Coffee, with pivotal irrigation. I have a feeling that Ch.c hates chemical fertilizers and I am curious to get the results on the outcome of their experiment.

      [quote]Welll then you are not aware that in many eastern countries they have what is called BLACK SOIL ! HIGHLY FERTILE ! [/quote]

      Ch.c is bloody right. Anything you can grow in the East, you can grow in the South of Brazil. I can tell you from my first hand experience!!

    • ch.c.

      Correcting “You will hardly find a Swiss farmer with a 100 hectares farm.”
      Yesssss…they have much much SMALLER farms !
      But…but….but…..the price of their land is not simply higher than your most expensive land in SP, but but but……MANY MANY MANY TIMES MORE EXPENSIVE !!!!
      A 3 hectares farm nearby a city could be sold for US$ 5-7 millions….STRICT MINIMUM, if and when there is a seller. Lot of willing buyers, no seller !
      The acquirer will not even be allowed to build new houses for re-sale. Farm land can only be used for farming. But many wealthy people would be delighted to buy such farms to become gentleman farmers !!!!!!
      And farmers know this and that is why they dont sell !
      Our farmers tend to be highly in debts but at a very much smaller interests rates than brazilian farmers, even when compared with your subsidized loans ! End resuilts : he could sell, pay back the loans and…RETIRE as a multi millionaire ! I am talking for farms nearby the 10 largest cities of the country.
      Thus let me smile when I read an idiot writing “The value of Brazil is backed by the wealth in its ground, its water and its temperature.”
      This guy never travelled outside his favela !
      😀 😉 😀 😉

    • AUGUSTUS

      JOAO…. but but but but (LOL)
      While acknowledging the legitimacy of your comments, and recently more “mindful” that most comments related to the Economy which are made by the knowledgeable “Swiss python” (a grudging admission), who has demonstrated superior expertise in most issues regarding the world economy, I have just a “feeling” (no data/ no proof) that the Chinese economy may have taken an (extended) momentum of its own, which may be perfectly capable of hovering on its own, quite independently of the Western World for the foreseeable future… Naturally, they are bound to reach a period of recession sooner or later but considering how backward the Chinese society and how undeveloped their economy used to be under the grip of MaoÀ¢€™ absolute totalitarianism, along with the immense size of its market, I suspect that their on-going period of growth is likely to overtake the huge American equivalent which lasted an entire decade during the 1960’s…. Mostly likely this unprecedented, uniquely Chinese phenomenon may outlast its main powerful competitor by at least 1 additional decade until it runs out of fuel…

      Yet, regarding the Swiss bloggerÀ¢€™s comments regarding the US RE-Emergence, I fully concur with his views (aware such agreement is not required), not only because it makes sense, but also because its signs are already becoming visible albeit somewhat faint, for there are less discussions about the credit crunch, the gas prices are plummeting, and the US Dollar has lately been rising against the Euro and the Pound…
      On the other hand, not playing the À¢€œdevilÀ¢€™s advocate, couldnÀ¢€™t the such re-emergence also be considered as yet another contributing factor for a possible extension of the next Brazilian BUST?…

    • ch.c.

      the recent BOOM has been shockingly long and without any doubt fueled by a never ending hunger from the Chinese economy
      Never heard of STRETCHED Bull or Bear markets ?

      And I repeat : the economy has nothing to do with STOCKS bull or bear markets ! Look at China and Vietnam economies still booming but their stocks markets DOWN OVER 60 % in less than one year !
      Dont you believe that Russia and the many neighbouring nations are not already investing TENS of billions US$ in agriculture.
      Welll then you are not aware that in many eastern countries they have what is called BLACK SOIL ! HIGHLY FERTILE !
      In contrario the Amazon soil is not so fertile, believe it or not. Brazil is using far far more FERTILIZERS per hectare.

      For your info only all of you are sure that the EU cant feed itself. Dead wrong. We are NET exporters of agricultural products.l
      True we subsidizem bgut because we care for the well being of our farmers. And Brazil subsidizes TOO but mainly your commercial agriculture MAINLY for exports buit very little your family farmers ! And if the EU agrees to import soyabeans is simply because you have MORE cheap land. But lets face it most of the agriculture inputs in Brazil is provided by the EU and the USA. Without these “tools” you could not produce as effectively as you do now. Thus believing you enrich yourselves more is DEAD WRONG. Far more profits came from the INPUTS providers. Just look at Syngenta, Monsanto, John Deere, BASF, Bayer, etc etc !!!!!!
      Smiles smiles smiles

      Funny that the giant agro producer that Brazil is HAS NOT INVESTED A LOT OF MONEY IN R&D for seeds, fongicides, pesticides, GM seeds, trucks, harvesters and not even in infrastructure to transport these hundreds of millions tons of agro products wether it be for local consumption or exports !

      And even on productivity per hectare you are a backward country. I feel sorry to underline it.
      Switzerland is not in the black soil zone. But our potatoes per hectare production is TWICE Brazil, our wheat production is TWICE Brazil and our corn production is 3 X Brazil.
      Better yet, since we consume these goods mostly locally, we have neither the distance from farm to ports, nor the oceans shipping costs !!!!!!
      But we still pay our farmers US 500.- per ton…..ex farms !
      You will hardly find a Swiss farmer with a 100 hectares farm.
      End results : You will hardly find a Swiss farmer poor. They tend to have a BMW or a Mercedes….. or both !!!!!

      This said one has to understand how we subsidize them, quite differently than in Brazil.
      We dont subsidize their investments but their production.
      But…but…but….based upon a production quota per farmer.
      Example : if a farmer produces milk, his quota is let say 10’000 liters per year. If he produces 8000 liters he will get subsidizes on his 8000 liters but if he produces 15000 liters he will have ONLY 10’000 liters subsidized.
      Not over : our farmers in our plains are much less subsidized that farmers in non leveled lands, because we want to keep these farmers in the mountains or hilly areas !!!!! Therefore wherever you go in the country it is well maintained not only by the system as explained but also by strict production/environmental laws.

      Welll…… Brazil does the EXACT OPPOSITE : You subsidize the farmers investments, and 75 % of your subsidizes go to your minority commercial farmers mostly for exports and only 25 % spreaded to 5 millions family farmers which production is mostyl for local consumption !!!!!!
      Therefore your family farmers are mostly poors due to YOUR subsidizes SYSTEM and NOT due to OUR subsidizes SYSTEM !!!!!
      And our small farmers will continue to be able to afford a quality lifestyle because we will not let them going down contrary to what YOU DO !
      And our ranking for the country environment will remain…… AT THE TOP !

      Joao your ” BECAUSE the U.S. and EU economies went through a longer period of prosperity” is wrong. Every 4-5 years there has been an important slowdown or some type of recession. The last one was 2001-2002 ! The peak should have been in 2006 and was stretched by one year ONLY. And the stretching was mostly due the emerging markets not due to the USA or EU.

      But you will continue to grow, no doubt. What is less certain is your currencies.

    • João da Silva

      Augustus
      [quote]This crucial factor has undoubtedly influenced the natural BOOM followed immediately by a BUST… As such, without any recognition for “improvement” within the Brazilian economy, one must acknowledge that recently introduced external factors have miraculously assuaged the vicious Brazilian economic cycles.
      [/quote]

      Augustus, we rode an unusually long period of boom,BECAUSE the U.S. and EU economies went through a longer period of prosperity. I have been reading Ch.cÀ‚´s comments for almost two years and he is almost always correct about the world economy.When he says “the best emerging market is U.S.A”, he is right (though I would rephrase and say “Reemerging Market”).If the U.S and E.U go into a deep recession, ChinaÀ‚´s growth rate is affected and so is ours, as we have become a supplier of Rawmaterial to the Chinese. We have discussed about this issue many times before you came into this blog. Whenever, Ch.c gives some forecast, I do listen to him carefully !

      Hope Ch.cÀ‚´s ego hasnt hit the stratosphere. 😀

    • AUGUSTUS

      In partial agreement with the Swss Blogger… Yet, paraphrasing JOAO… but but but….
      While CH-C is correct regarding his “boom and bust” remark concerning the historical behavior of the Brazilian economy, and although I have repeatedly stated that the Brazilian “propaganda” displayed in this BLOG are ridiculously optimistic… I would like to make just a minor adjustment… Though I would FAR from discount the possibility of another BUST in the near future, if compared with the period between the 1970’s through 2000, when the cycle was ridiculously obvious, I would like to recognize that the recent BOOM has been shockingly long and without any doubt fueled by a never ending hunger from the Chinese economy. This crucial factor has undoubtedly influenced the natural BOOM followed immediately by a BUST… As such, without any recognition for “improvement” within the Brazilian economy, one must acknowledge that recently introduced external factors have miraculously assuaged the vicious Brazilian economic cycles.

    • ch.c.

      To moody et al !
      – the same as you said could have been said when the Chinese stock market went down from 6000 to 4800, also a 30 % decline.
      Wellllll….its is now 2200 !!!! Hopefully you bought at your “great buy” signal.
      Smiles

      – Exactly the same for Vietnam !

      – and your “Brazil’s interest rates are fiscally responsible.” is laughable. They are the 2nd World highest after inflation, after Turkey.
      In my view, basede upon your statement, you as a brazilian consumer truly enjoy buying a car and paying 33 % rates, 55 % on your consumers goods, and 163 % for overdrafts !!!!!! RIGHT ????? Well in my view only idiots like you are.

      – And I dont know if you know anything about finance as you pretend but may be you did not pay attention yet that despite your huge huge interests rates differentials against the US$, your currency and others, declined by 10 % or more in a short time.
      The carry trades (I bet you dont even know what it is) are OVER ! Just ask Joao when I went out : 1,58 !!!!!!!

      —– Ohhhhh and by the time you wrote 54’000 for your stock market, wellllll it was 51’500 !

      Stupid questions Moody et al : what follows a Boom ? A Bust ! And what follows a Bubble ? A Burst !
      You dont trust me ? Just check by yourself your currency and BOVESPA history….if you can and if you really understand finances !

      Finally : somewhat funny your Moody et al. They got it all wrong…if you are not aware…in their subprimes, Alt-A, CDOs, CLS, MBS, RMBS, ARS…RATINGS !!!!

      Idiots just follow the crowd, Idiots follow leading losers. Winners anticipate !

      😀 😉 😀 😉

    • ch.c.

      To George and all !!!!! I keep smiling !
      1) Contrary to what you all believe, economic growth is not tied with the up and down of the stock market. By the way neither are the currencies.
      – China and Vietnam have still a very high growth rate, but their stock market are down by over 60 % since their late 2007 top !
      – Brazil had an average economic growth rate of 7 % (you read well – no error) between 1940 and 1980. Astounding isnt it ? Well that did not avoid your currency to collapse during these 40 years.
      – Despite your economic growth rate is still high when compared to the USA, it remains your currency is weakening. So is the Euro finally.

      Bull markets reverse to bear markets, bubbles reverse to air, and booms reverse to busts !

      Brazil is a BOOM AND BUST ECONOMY. And at every bull market Brazil says “this time is different and it will be sustainable”.
      Well this time you had not only a BOOM buit also a BUBBLE !
      Brazil said just a few months ago you are immune from a developed nations recession.
      May be only.
      But certainly not from a stock market wash down similar to China and Vietnam.
      A large part of your stock markets boom had the impulse from foreign investors, mostly from developed nations. Guess what happen when they reduce their exposure. Welll they simply SELL.

      Let me give an interesting insight :
      – By law. Brazilian pensions funds can have a maximum of 50 % in stocks exposure.
      – But your 15 largest pensions funds are at 70 %. Illegal but no one in the government said anything……as usual ! Guess why.
      – Your pensions funds recentls said they are going to reduce their stocks exposure “over time”
      – Your Government official supervising your pensions funds said “We cant force pensions funds to sell…when the market is falling”

      Now guess what will happen to YOUR pension fund IF YOUR stock market keeps falling JUST similar to the average decline of the other BRIC members !!!!!!

      Good bye !!!!!!!!! After you will have stabilized YOUR stock markets by using YOUR foreign currencies reservesm foreigners may re-enter and increase again their emerging countries investments.
      Sorry but you cornered yourselves….ONCE MORE !
      Vietnam had accumulated a much higher foreign currencies reserve than Brazil did, despite its GDP is way smaller than yours.
      In one month alone, August 2008, they sold 15 % of their foreign currencies to stabilize their falling currency, to no avail.

      Ohhhhhhh dear Brazilians, just refer to some of my previous comments some weeks ago, when as usual your government pride stated how good they were by having a US$ 200 billion foreign currencies reserves.
      I said : funny in April 1999 Brazil had then their highest foreign currencies reserves that stood at US 99 billion which was nearly similar to the actual amount of US$ 200 billion when adjusted for inflation, exchange rate, etc
      Welllll your currency decline started 3 months earlier, in January 1999.

      😀 😉 😀 😉

      Ohhhh let me underline this ; you are just at the start oif your meltdown. You havent seen anything yet !

      Finally who remember that a few months ago I wrote : the best emerging market on nearth is now ….THE USA ?????????
      😀 😉 😀 😉

    • moody et al

      Good Time To Buy
      If the market was worth 73,000 when it was declared investment grade, then it is certainly worth 54,000.

      The world needs to eat, the Chinese need to build, and a world run on ethanol is now.

      The value of Brazil is backed by the wealth in its ground, its water and its temperature. Brazil’s interest rates are fiscally responsible.

      With the dollar at 1.68 it is a bargain for foreign investors.

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